Day 143 Question 143:
Are men and women equal? Why or why not?
I guess this question would all depend on who you ask. Some may say yes but in their heads be thinking about how a woman’s place is meant to be in the home cooking and cleaning while wrangling a bunch of children. Other’s may say that we live in a society where women are starting to overpower men. It is an unanswerable question really because it is really based on opinions and places you go.
Now, with this being my blog and knowing that I am chock full of thoughts and opinions you know I am going to throw mine out there. I got a good laugh last night. I was working at the restaurant and this couple came in that are regulars. I am pretty much the one that always waits on them. I would guess them to be in their early 60’s and they are beyond nice. We were pretty slow and the man was asking me a bunch of questions about my jobs and my education and I told him that I wanted to work for an organization that focused on women’s rights. He laughed and asked me if I was going to join the Tea Party next. He told me that he knew a bunch of other better subjects I should get my degree in. He wasn’t being offensive and I didn’t think much of it but I did know that he really did think that the whole idea of women’s rights was silly. Him and my dad would be great friends. I do not believe men and women are equal because we still live in a world where a lot of men believe that are dominant to women (before you overreact…I said a lot…not all). With this kind of mentality, women are always going to be considered second-rate citizens in the world. Trust me, there is nothing that grates my skin more than a victim mentality. I am not at all implying that women are victims….I believe if we fight hard enough we are able to have anything we want. I just believe that as a society we have not completely evolved in order to see the genders as equal.
I don’t know…maybe I really am one of those “feminists” that my dad always pokes fun at…I pretty much hate labels though. I would like to think I am not annoying though in picking out every little tiny detail of “rights” and “wrongs”. For example, if a friend of mine (a male friend) called me a bitch…I may get upset but I am not going to fly off the handle about how disrespectful that term is to women. I believe this country has become ridiculous when it comes to always being “politically correct” and honestly, sometimes I can be a bitch. I guess I just see so many women day in and day out that have this potential for greatness….these women that can be leaders and entrepeneurs and activists….and they can even be wives and mothers but instead they just chase after men with money. They want someone to take care of them. I see talent wasted and I hate that. I know it is their choice and if that is what they want then that is their business…I just hate seeing anyone waste major potential. I hate when anyone acts like their stereotype. Women play a large role in us not being equals at this point in life. Don’t get me wrong, we have come sooooo far and I love to see that….but we aren’t quite to where we should be (at least in my opinion). We have not seen a woman president….we see very few female political leaders in fact. I once saw a news broadcast and a male commentator was asked why he believed that there has never been a female president and his response was, “Besides the PMS and mood swings?” Women are emotional creatures (well a lot…not all) and I guess I just don’t see why that is a downfall. Yes, it can be in some situations but it can also be very advantageous. Emotions can equal analysis.
I guess because I am a woman it comes so easily to have this natural pride in my gender. I want the best for all other females in the world because I see women as being so powerful and so beautiful. I don’t want to go on a rant about all of the horrible things that have held us back in society. We have come too far to focus on the past….the era of the 1950’s housewife is over (yes I know this statement is going to get lost in translation and I am going to get clobbered0…this is 2012 and we are part of a world in which BOTH men and women have been extremely successful and have taken the lead when it comes to family and professional lives. I hope to see women keep thriving…especially those women in other countries where they are looked at as basically nothing. I hope our world starts seeing the advantages of both genders and we are able to see a shift from male domination in certain fields to equality between the sexes.
“….the era of the 1950’s housewife is over…”
In the 1950’s the wife typically stayed at home and raised the children full time while also looking after the household. Houses / streets were seldom empty during the day deterring crime and allowing young children to play together and encouraging a natural sense of community. The husband typically earned enough to support the whole family on a single income.
Today both husband and wife are typically REQUIRED to work full just to pay the bills and so all housework and other jobs must be done in the evening and at weekends. Houses and suburban streets are typically deserted during the day and children are raised increasingly by the state in school and at daycare centres. Because parents are so tired in the evenings and busy at the weekends children are also placed in front of the TV a lot more and raised by MTV, Disney and Hollywood etc as well as by the thousands of corporate adverts they are bombarded with each week.
After feminism, with two incomes typically coming in each week instead of one the state was able to increase taxes and use this revenue stream as collateral to borrow *even more* money to fund its illegal wars and other illicit activities as well as to generally grow government to an even bigger size.
These are some of the negative effects of the feminist movement which people rarely talk about. Before feminism many women WANTED to compete with men in the work place but were prevented from doing so due to social conventions. After feminism many women WANT to be able to bring up their own children full time but they are prevented from doing so due to the government’s raising of taxes.
Have women really won freedom….. or has the state simply used the IDEA of feminism to break up the family and take over the role of authoritarian husband and provider for all women? After all, most independent career women with children rely on state benefits of some kind. And instead of working all day long for their own families, women now work all day long for some random boss, pay taxes to the state and employ someone else to look after their own children.
Is feminism freedom …. or socialism?
This blog is called In MY Opinion for a reason…
I wasn’t arguing that your blog wasn’t your opinion. It was not meant as a personal dig at you either 🙂
I was just exploring the subject and throwing out some challenging questions. I was clear to say “These are SOME of the negative effects of the feminist movement which people rarely talk about”. I think that is true, don’t you?
I don’t think that anyone can argue with the basic premise of feminism. The movement was well overdue! However, therein lies the danger. Social movements which appear to be ‘no brainers’ (ie ‘more freedoms, rights and equality for women’) are the most easy to hijack and manipulate by evil men who do not want women to be free, or society as a whole to be free.
Not everything about feminism has been a disaster – of course not! But it hasn’t exactly been a success either for the reasons I outlined above. Do you not think that to question the results of feminism, and find flaws in the feminist ideology (wherever they exist) is to BE a feminist?
To just blindly accept anything which has the label “Feminism” attached to it makes us ‘sheeple’ by definition.
The main problem with feminism is that although the world is male dominated and patriarchal and has been for a very long time (!) most men in society are as much slaves to that patriarchal system as women are! Perhaps they are even more enslaved to it than we are!
And so to fight for equal rights as men is – in many ways – to fight for the right to be equally enslave to the state as men already are. Today men and women work side by side in the office and together they work flat out, pay taxes to the state to fund its wars which slaughter children overseas, while handing over their own children to the state to be indoctrinated as good little statist comrades. I’m not sure this is healthy progress.
These are uncomfortable concepts, I know 🙂
Personally I don’t like this obsession with men and women having to be ‘equal’. How can they be ‘equal’? They are so different!
Do we care if the sun and the moon are ‘equal’? ….or do we just adore both for what they each are?! In the race for this thing called ‘equality’ both men and women are being encouraged (by the state and by the wealthy elite ruling classes) to give up maleness and femaleness and become ‘equal’………which is to say become consumer slaves, metrosexual, power dressing, competitive, hierarchical, celebrity obsessed, narcissistic, shallow, over sexed, dumbed down citizens of the new world order.
It’s basically Huxley’s ‘Brave New World’. Children are to be raised by the state and everyone is equal in their service to the ‘hierarchy’.
I just happen to believe that to raise our own children (full time – shock horror!) and impart our own values onto them is the most *radical* and *empowering* thing we can do right now!
After all, what message do we give to our children if we can *afford* to raise our children full time (I know many mothers can’t) yet we CHOOSE to have a ‘fulfilling’ career instead?
Just saying…. I’m not ranting at *you* – just the world! 🙂
I love the way you said this. I have also noticed how men and women are pressured to both become wage slaves just to provide for their families, and children are left without the attention of parents… Don’t misunderstand. I was a single mom, and remain grateful that I had that option… How nice if it had worked out that each spouse worked 20 hours per week…
Abandon TV: I certainly agree with you. Have women come that far? Because we can wear pants, burn our bras, and bring home the bacon and fry it up doesn’t mean we’ve won anything.
I do think the are equal just not the same … like a pound of chocolate isn’t the same as a pound of gummbears … both sweet and sugary and make you happy … but not the same
I agree. I was going to write something similar, but the way you put it is much better. Hmm. Sugary goodness.
thanks but I think you said it perfectly
Women can sometimes control very little. 5 Pakistani women are missing because they were videod modestly celebrating at a wedding, when 2 men from another village chose to join in, though not directly celebrating with the seated women. A village court decided these women shamed their families by simply being in the same space with men who were not family members. They are now missing suspected murdered. So yes, Western women can turn their talent and energy to things other women in the world couldn’t conceive of. Theirs is a terrible plight.
As a professional wife and mom, I have to ask a question, here:
“EVEN”? as in “EVEN BE WIVES AND MOTHERS”?
I might fly off the handle about how disrespectful THAT is.
I was not meaning to be disrespectful. I said that because I didn’t want any men or women to think that being a mother isnt just as important. I think being a parent is the hardest job in the world. I knew I hadn’t been mentioning that so I didn’t want people to think I overlooked it.
I love and hate this blog because sometimes I am unable to express myself clearly….getting lost in translation is so easy. I do apologize if I offended you because that was not my intention. I have a great respect for wives and mothers..well for wives and mothers that take care of their children. I am not a wife or a mother and I admire the women that have taken on those roles because I know it is not always easy. I messed up by using the word even…if I would have been saying what I meant it would have made a lot more sense but in print it did come off completely wrong. Again, I apologize.
Maybe I’m too touchy. I accept this explanation and we’ll try again soon. Okay? I just get tired of people asking me “will you be at home or do you work . . . ” as if!
Sorry to make you appologize, but, hey — you worded it very well. 😉 Truce?
Men and women are equal?…It would be a big question never to find a definite answer…because there are so many men and women in the world and anyone who give his/her own opinion is, yes, either a man or a woman. I think it should be more practical to raise a question in each case: my right? your right? is she/he victim? are they? is this case unfair?,,,you have given yet only 143 questions, you could give more. I don’t see you have forced readers anything to agree with you. Don’t be afraid and keep questioning, I’m looking forward to think about it together.
Thank you so kindly :0)
not at certain things, no. feel free to specify the question a little. i don’t mind. i’ll wait…
I think people need to get it straight that you don’t want to be ‘equal’ you want to be ‘treated equally.’ I don’t want to be like a man, I don’t want to be like my neighbor, I don’t even want to be like my rich uncle, but when it comes to my job, the law, and even my mechanic, I would like them to treat me with the same sort of respect they would a male.
Rhetorically – YES, I mean who could argue otherwise and not be branded as insensitive pig
Current social scenario – NO, no matter what we would like to believe, women and men are not treated equally in any society even today, do not confuse feminism with women getting equal treatment, they glass ceilings still exists, at homes, in society, in business enterprises/ industries, in sports, in politics, you name any field and you will have number of examples of how the discrimination happens even today.
Personal opinion – No. Woman and man are not equal and they should never be equated. Woman deserve much more, because they have a much critical part in the development & growth of human civilization. Woman are much more stronger than man (emotionally, logically, physically, yes physically too I have seen my mother, sister and now wife work as hard as any men can), they deserve better. I believe a world ruled by women would have much more peace, love and understanding 🙂
The ‘glass ceiling’ argument is an interesting one.
There is the argument (backed up by lots of statistical evidence) that women’s lower average pay in the business/ corporate / executive world is generally related to women’s own CHOICES and not because they are being oppressed by men.
In other words, women tend to place a higher value on friends, family, security, free time, financial stability, health (mental and physical), a social life and a good quality of life than men do.
And women tend to place a lower value on fast living, high risk and high stress jobs, being ruthless, heartless, competitive and often highly immoral in the backstabbing, ruthless and destructive environment of the ‘rat race’.
Women may not often earn the top whack in any particular field, but at the same time they are also less likely to go bankrupt, have high blood pressure, have no close friends, have a coke habit, have a heart attack and commit suicide too.
Given that girls now outperform boys in schools and more women end up in higher education than men it is perhaps a little insulting for people (not you, I mean people generally) to say that women are being ‘kept down’ by men. It assumes women with equal (or perhaps greater) abilities than men must automatically WANT to become just like a man, and work like a man and embrace the goals and ambitions which motivate a man.
This is the problem with ‘equality’ and with its offshoot called ‘equal pay’. Women are being offered equal pay but only IF they agree to become just like men! But women aren’t men! And in many ways these men (as I explained in a previous comment) are already slaves to the state.
Another way to reduce the pay gap would be to elevate the status of work traditionally done by women (not least motherhood!) …. but this is not really happening. When you think about it being a woman (an obvious example is being a mother) is NOT really being valued any more today than pre feminism. In fact in many ways being a woman has become devalued. In this post feminist society women are only being valued (offered the chance of better pay) *IF* they choose to live like men and join in the male orientated, hierarchical ‘rat race’.
For example a woman in the west may not be able to support herself enough to raise her own child full time, but she will be offered the chance to give her child away to state school and daycare and have strangers raise it while she goes off gain a high position in a bank in the city (a bank which may be helping to enslave the third world with debts and therefore be a major cause of starvation and child poverty there). In return she will get a decent salary (half of which will be payed as taxes and go towards funding illegal government genocidal wars in the middle east which are slaughtering children every day) but she will have enough to buy clothes and stuff every weekend which will help make her feel like a classy independent post feminist woman.
Is this what feminists fought for?
There are two ways to reduce the pay gap. One is for the state to help and encourage women to give up being women and go off and work like men (like my example above), and the other is for everyone to actually elevate the value of women in society, whatever they choose to do – to elevate the feminine principle where (for example) blood can mean life and not just death.
“…..I believe a world ruled by women would have much more peace, love and understanding….”
I think this is also an unfortunate way to put it. If women ‘ruled’ the world then it would still be essentially a patriarchal system (ie a system of RULE which just means FORCE and VIOLENCE). Women are far more pragmatic than men and so a world ‘ruled by women’ would probably end up even more barbaric (but efficient!) than today’s male ruled world! LOL
If the feminine principle was instead elevated to be equal to the male principle then we would end up with a world of BALANCE. A world not ‘ruled’ by anyone. The world would just be in harmony. The world would have structure and organisation ….. yet it would also be without rigid hierarchy and violence authority.
This is why I cringe at the obsession with ‘equality’, it’s so easy for this concept to be turned into ‘fairness’. Let’s not forget that when tyrants get into power everything also becomes ‘fair’ and ‘equal’… everyone is equally a slave!!!
I think it’s much healthier to talk only in terms of freedom and respect 🙂
The topic seems to be very close to your heart and since you have taken so much time and effort I should respond to your observations. Please do not take it as an argument for the sake of argument but as an healthy discussion which may bring more clarity on the subject.
Thank you Diane once again for raising this issue, it really deserve a lot more attention that it gets. I am again reiterating that many of the issues which seems far bigger and more critical (e.g. terrorism, wars, economic slowdown) can be resolved in a much simpler manner if we are willing to look at the differently i.e. through the perspective of a woman… As you indicated, woman are more pragmatic, the are less likely to have blood pressure or go bankrupt… taking the same argument forward, I would say a society ruled by women would be more pragmatic, would live a healthier life, will have lower up/down economic swings, conflicts can be resolved through peaceful measures rather than bullets & bombs. “An eye for an eye makes the whole society blind” – Mahatma Gandhi, and this is exactly what is happening for centuries all around us. Things will only change if we are open to think about the possibilities of what the change can bring about.
First of, saying that woman choose to have a lesser paying job, along with all the platitudes which overall mean to say that they want it that way, they deserve it – it is the same kind of argument used by those in power against those who are powerless or weaker. For centuries Imperialist used the same argument to rule over others, to discriminate against others based on race, caste, creed, nationality. They had strong belief that the nation they are occupying needs them, the savages don’t have any idea and it is the duty of the masters to show them the light, yes till they time they see the light they might as well work for them as slaves. “See how happy they are doing the physical work, remaining subordinate to their masters, serving their masters, they wont be able to survive without their masters”.
There were Britishers (and even some Indians) who believed that the British rule over India was for the benefit of native Indians. And for this kind benefit they will charge a small fee by exploiting the people, the resources, anything that will fancy them. The same story goes for all those countries who ruled others, and its not something which one can brush under the carpet saying it used to happen long time back in the past. No, it used to happen as recently as 1990’s in South Africa and discrimination still continues against those who are considered weak.
All the points you have made regarding women not trying to ape men to make the same amount of money as men, are valid, but they do no justify the fact that the discrimination still continue. Not just in term of money, but also in terms of positions offered for similar experience. Some organization today are taking note of this situation and do try to put some kind of quota in place at the top level to ensure that there is at least a respectable representation of women at the time. But such organization are still too few and are present only in few countries/societies.
Like you talk about equality & fairness, I would say the same thing apply for Rule by FORCE or FEAR and a Just Rule. What makes you think that the rule by Woman will be patriarchal (it would be matriarchal) and the difference is not just the word, the difference is the whole approach towards the the rule and governance. Patriarchal rule is the rule of Force & Fear, matriarchal rule could offer an alternate. I have seen such small communities in India (though the overall country is dominated by patriarchal system) which are matriarchal and offer a significant different perspective. Based on what I have witnessed (in North-East India, Kerala, Parts of Gujarat and Uttarakhand regions of India), I firmly believe that the societies where women perform a more active role tend to be far more just, peaceful and loving than those patriarchal one’s which are driven by Force and Fear.
Have a good day 🙂
Thanks for the reply and your thoughts. As you say, it’s a good discussion 🙂
I think the crux of the issue for me (which I may not have expressed very well) is the phrase ‘a society RULED by women’. The idea of ‘rule’ implies (in fact it requires) the initiation of force/ violence be used against the population by the ‘rulers’.
To illustrate what I mean: I happen to disagree with some of the policies of the current ‘rulers’ who operate in my area. For example I disagree with the policy of the current illegal Iraq war and I do not wish to spend a penny supporting the genocide of Iraq children (or anyone else for that matter). But the ‘rulers’ who claim to ‘rule’ this piece of land where I was born use threats of violence against my person and property in order to FORCE me to fund their war against Iraq.
If I refused to fund this war they would send me threats and eventually send men round to my house dressed up in blue costumes and armed with clubs and tasers to drag me off to court and maybe even lock me inside a cage for a few years. This is the cold, hard reality of ‘rule’. Our whole society (our whole world) is based on this system of ‘rule’ over the masses by a tiny handful of ‘rulers’ who ‘rule’ through force/ violence. Every ‘policy’ and every ‘law’ is imposed on us and enforced through the initiation of violence, or the threat of it. In fact the initiation of force / violence against us is what defines a ‘law’ in the first place and makes it distinct from a peaceful, voluntary agreement or transaction.
One of the most obvious effects of ‘rule’ is redistribution of wealth by force. Whether it is to fund a war or to fund a hospital is immaterial. If I force you to give me half your earnings next week by turning up at your house and threatening to lock you up in a cage, that is theft/ extortion. It doesn’t matter if I then spend your money on guns for my mafia or give it all away to deserving charities, it’s still violent theft which is immoral behaviour – plus it denies you access and control over half your earnings.
If women *ruled* the world then that implies they are ALSO using the initiation of force/ violence to do their ‘ruling’. If not then I don’t think we can really call it ‘rule’. THAT was my point.
It’s like, if I started a ‘war’ with France but I did not use any weapons, and I didn’t act aggressively towards them in any way then I can hardly call it a ‘war’ or an ‘invasion’. I could not say I had just ‘invaded France’ …… I could only say I was a ‘tourist on holiday’ LOL
So my question to you would have to be: when you talk about ‘a society RULED by women’ what exactly are you talking about?
Are you talking about women taking over from men and becoming the new rulers and initiating force and violence against the rest of society?
Or are you talking about a society which has elevated (what are traditionally regarded as) ‘feminine principles’ and strategies such as nurture, care, empathy, communication, collaboration, not slaughtering children in wars, not having wars at all, not forcing people to fund wars against their will, freedom, lack of hierarchy, life is precious, initiating violence is not the way to get things done, let’s at least not go around killing children ….. etc?
Ultimately we either live in a society based on violent coercive rulers or we live in a society based on voluntary, peaceful transactions.
The supposed battle between Male and female, men and women is in so many ways a red herring. The fact that we see it as a ‘battle between the sexes’ is in itself the result of being brought up in a violent, competitive (in the most unhealthy sense), and hierarchical system. This system likes to play men and women off each other just as it likes to play different classes off against each other or different political parties off against each other.
As I said in a previous comment, 99.9% of the men in this world are just as much slaves to the current patriarchal system as women are. You could even argue they are even more enslaved than women are!
Feminism often says girls are taught to expect less and be happy to serve men (which is true). But it’s also true that boys are taught to expect less also, and to be happy to serve the hierarchy and serve their rulers. Boys are taught that to be a hero and protect their nation (their tribe, their family) means to risk their lives in some illegal war in the middle east which violates the Geneva convention and only profits the bankers who loan money (at interest) to the government to fund it. Even if these young men get out of it alive and with all of their limbs intact they will be traumatised for life (PTSD) and have a much higher chance of ending up alcohol, drug dependent and homeless.
We’re all slaves to the current rulers.
And patriarchy is not so much an imbalance BETWEEN men and women as the result of an imbalance IN men and women. Men’s natural dominance, assertiveness and tribal leadership has been reduced to attending sports games in arenas – instead of being used to protect their families from predatory rulers taking over society. Meanwhile women’s natural sensitivity, compassion and empathy has been reduced to analysing celeb gossip and fashion minutiae instead of screaming “NOOOOOO!!!!!!” to the rulers when they hear about child murder, poverty, starvation, torture and other basic inhuman injustices.
Not only do women passively or actively support the injustices of their rulers, they are now turning to these violent rulers to act as surrogate husbands and provide ‘free money’ and other ‘free benefits’ (such as positive discrimination in the work place) all of which rely on violence being initiated against the public at large.
In simple terms women are – thanks to this hijacked and twisted feminism – being encouraged to ditch their husbands (who generally earn money peacefully) and rely on the state instead (who steals all of its money by force).
The state rulers are only too happy offer women the chance to gain even more ‘equality’ and ‘fairness’ because it gives government an excuse to increase their power and violent coercion by the state and increasing size of government. It also means that as women increasingly rely on the government’s violent redistribution of wealth and other ‘laws’ to help them be more ‘independent’ (spot the irony) women will end up dependent on government (like they were their husbands in the 50’s) and so they will defend the state no matter how coercive and downright evil it becomes!
Does that make 21 century women ‘liberated’?…… or have they just become Obama’s bitches? (or insert your own country’s violent rulers).
This feminism stuff is a lot more complex than we think it is! 🙂
“I guess because I am a woman it comes so easily to have this natural pride in my gender. I want the best for all other females in the world because I see women as being so powerful and so beautiful.” I love that part thank you. And though I believe there is room for growth all over the world in every part of humankind, as well as in women’s rights, we have come a long way. I think because of the rise (and media / public display!) in feminism since forever, it’s posing more of a “threat” to the patriarchal male masses so yes, we’re doing it right. Thanks for this!
First you say this: “We were pretty slow and the man was asking me a bunch of questions about my jobs and my education and I told him that I wanted to work for an organization that focused on women’s rights. He laughed and asked me if I was going to join the Tea Party next. He told me that he knew a bunch of other better subjects I should get my degree in. He wasn’t being offensive and I didn’t think much of it but I did know that he really did think that the whole idea of women’s rights was silly.”
And a short bit later you say this: “I guess I just see so many women day in and day out that have this potential for greatness….these women that can be leaders and entrepeneurs and activists….and they can even be wives and mothers but instead they just chase after men with money. They want someone to take care of them. I see talent wasted and I hate that. I know it is their choice and if that is what they want then that is their business…I just hate seeing anyone waste major potential.”
I’m seeing a distinct similarity between your thinking and that of the man at the restaurant.
Maybe so….I never got upset at the man as I don’t get upset at people in MY OPINION that are wasting their talents. Everyone is ENTITLED to their own opinions and their own actions in life. I try to be positive (try being the important word) and others choose to point out everyone’s flaws. I have a great respect for both genders and I am on a journey for more and more knowledge everyday. I do appreciate your commentary though.
I did not intend what I said to seem like a criticism. It was simply an observation. I am certainly not criticizing you for having an opinion. I am quite opinionated and cannot fault you for also being opinionated. I only meant to point out that your thinking and the man’s are not so far apart. I do not mean the man’s opinion about women’s rights is correct. You and the man may have different ideas about what qualifies as wasting talent, but both of you are saying talent should not be wasted.
I apologize if I came off harsh. I feel like this blog entry came with a lot of being lost in translation and in a way I felt like people got upset at me and were pointing out everything I said wrong and it just hit me wrong.
No worries. I know how these things can happen. I think you’re doing a fine job.
On a side note, I will be addressing soon, at my own blog, the questions in your Day 144 post.
Ahhh, this explains Question #144, which I read first! A complex subject with no clear one way or the other answers. Good for you for opening this can of worms! We can all learn from one another! Thank you!
No.. We’re infinitely better. Men should be subordinate Sherpas carrying heavy stuff, and we should be in charge. Starting with countries like Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan and Pakistan. I rarely if ever have met one who wasn’t obsessed with his own ego facade and need for dominance. Just once a man who wants to be the caretaker of a family without taking advantage of our nuturing good-will, and/or requiring subservience/obeisance, would be nice.
Disclaimer: this is *at least* half tongue in cheek.
For us, it’s not about men and women being equal. Why aren’t animals equal to humans?
Bella and DiDi